Summonses
Smeagol? Is that you?
Here’s the heart of the argument.
“Since e-bikes do not require a license, drivers of e-bikes can simply ignore their traffic summons with no repercussions whatsoever, making any enforcement futile,” the police spokesperson said. However, the new requirement that cyclists appear in court, or face an arrest warrant if they fail to, creates “a strong incentive to show up in court.”
The article does a good job of explaining why s court summons is any where from an unfair inconvenience to down right dangerous for some, but the initial concern should be addressed.
ITT: the angry car brained
I love how they never address the fact that the punishment is way heavier for a cyclist than it is for a driver. Nice distraction.
fuckcars is leaking again
Unlike cars which are constantly leaking poison
I mean, people do too? urine and feces isn’t exactly the healthiest stuff. not to mention the chemicals we use to wash our bodies, clothes, food, etc.
I wonder what the environmental impact difference is between a car and a family of four is.
I guess if we’re willing to destroy cars we should probably set our hygiene back 200-300 years while we’re at it. right?
This motherfucker actualy said urine and feces lmao
I see you’re French, let me translate.
les misérables et tu le piss et shit
edit:
Leave that bastardisation of my language out of your putrid mouth.
You’ve put your disorder right on display for all to see. Shame.
and what disorder is that?
edit:
LOL stop being insecure. It’s easier to just be comfortable with others doing their own thing.
more vague insults with zero meaning?
is this your dad?
lol you’re all kinds of toxic. Have a block
you got your skin on the outside like a chump
This is why I always run when the cops try to pull me over on my emoto. Cut through some yards and alleys and I’m long gone. I wear a helmet so good luck identifying me.
And here we see why a criminal court summons is necessary. Bikers will flagrantly violate traffic laws and then trespass to avoid responsibility. Thanks for providing an example so readily.
Why should I care about the law? I see the rich and powerful getting rewarded for their violations. It literally serves me no good to get myself caught when it’s near impossible I’ll get caught if I run.
Even the link with the unlocked article code didn’t work, here’s an easier way to read the article: https://archive.is/sZYDO
I will just leave this here…
Am I missing something? From what I see, this guy does tech repair videos. Did he get hit by an ebike?
He used to live in NYC, had an E-Bike and repeatedly posted videos about the out of control bureaucracy eating the city from within.
He has since moved to Texas, but NYC has haunted him for quite a while.
Edit: It’s an in-joke about his exasperation and temper relating to NYC and it’s weird double standards in legislation.
Bicyclists running reds? Is the court summons just to get a psyche eval? That’s mental.
Running reds, like speeding, isn’t inherently “dangerous”. It’s a legal term. In the same way that going 40.01 mph in a 40 is speeding, running the red by .1 second is legally the same as by 10 seconds.
In shitty American streets bikes are probably safer to keep at the back of a platoon, which running reds lets them do.
I mean this honestly, as a 20-year resident of NYC; fuck bikers. And e-bikers. Not a single one respects any traffic regulation. Laws mean nothing to them. One way street? Nah. Red light? Nope, I’ll ride past you and your toddler at 20mph so close you feel my breeze.
I’ve been biking here for the last 20 years. (Before the bike lanes!) For me, basically 95% of bikers are fine. 5% suck. Just like cars.
I also hate the 5% of bikers that suck.
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For me the 5% that suck aren’t because they go through red lights, or down the wrong way. I do this all of the time, and I’m never close to pedestrians. Pedestrians don’t even know I exist.
I don’t go on sidewalks, but I’m guessing that 95% of bikers on sidewalks are about to stop for a delivery and are going pretty slow.
The 5% that suck, for me, are the ones which do the “fly by” the commenter is talking about. Some biker going 25mph on their electric bike that gets within 6 inches of you.
This also happens with cars, and let me tell you, with a car, it makes my hair stand on end. It seems like the driver is saying, “let me show you how much I hate you.”
Years ago when a car would do this to me (when the bike lanes just started coming out, there were a lot of people who were super mad), it would trigger a fight response, and I would catch up and prevent them from moving - just make them sit there - they would go batshit crazy. In retrospect, that was probably pretty dumb to do.
I think the answer to the biker problem, is not threats against bikers, but basically, make some thoroughfares biker only. Like all of Broadway, and maybe 1st or 8th ave. Mamdani should follow through on his campaign to hold Uber eats and etc, accountable. And then some sort of marketing, “Don’t be an asshole - don’t buzz people - this means you, delivery drivers and Bros on city bikes!”
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There are also some other undercurrents in play here. I wouldn’t assume leftreddit is in this camp, but a certain percentage of NYC is.
There is a segment of NYC’s population that “secretly” hates the immigrants and/or black people. Most of the delivery bikers are immigrants. And they are mostly black. It used to be most of the delivery bikers were Hispanic, but I think that has shifted. I don’t know real numbers though…
So, not only is this guy zooming past fast for a delivery, but he’s also an immigrant and he’s also black. Really triggers some people.
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Anyhow…
I hope that NYC doesn’t go back to the anti biker stance. But I do hope they put weight and speed restrictions on bikes.
The article doesn’t describe a “biker problem” though. It specifically is talking about e-bikes and electric scooters.
It follows actions by city officials from Paris to Honolulu to Hoboken, N.J., who are responding to residents angry about zippy vehicles with silent electric motors zooming down sidewalks and streets, often startling people, and occasionally hitting pedestrians.
A manually powered bicycle or scooter is a lot different from an electric powered version capable of 20-30mph.
Unfair treatment of one group versus another isn’t right and more cycle friendly infrastructure is needed but do you put both regular and e-bikes on that infrastructure to share it? Wouldn’t that lead to a lot of the same complaints that sharing with cars currently generates?
I do think you’re right that it’s not all of any one of these groups (cyclists or motorists) that are problematic; we just notice the ones that are problematic the most. That said, cyclists are the minority which means they need “imperfect allies” of motorists to drive the change that leads to more, better cycling infrastructure.
I don’t know the best way to go about that but ignoring the laws you’re required to follow isn’t a great way to go about it. I’d propose instead that working to change the rules for cyclists so that they aren’t bound by the “one way” and are allowed to legally proceed through a red as long as they can safely do so (no opposing traffic at the light/stop, they’ve stopped and confirmed it’s safe to proceed) and so on would be good. Then it might incentivize some motorists to ditch their car so they can get around easier as well as improve the experience for current cyclists.
All of this is assuming the traffic laws in NYC work similar to where I am.
I will assume you live in the midwest. Maybe some suburbia.
NYC is entirely different than suburbia and actually is also entirely different from SF, DC and Tokyo. I don’t know about other cities.
Within 30 seconds of biking from my apartment, I will already have seen.
- A car go through a red light.
- A car parked on the sidewalk.
- A delivery truck parked in the bike lane, and part of the street.
- Multiple people crossing the street randomly, not at crosswalks.
- I will have passed maybe 3 other bikers.
Within a minute:
- Massive construction on the street.
- Cars parked in the road.
- Dodged deep pot holes.
Within 5 minutes
- Multiple cars going through red lights, I would maybe guess 5.
- Multiple cars doing u-turns that are not allowed.
- Maybe 30 people walking across the street in random places.
- Some drugged up guy standing somewhere in the street.
- Hit an area where the streets are purposely laid out so, if you want to go the “right way” you have to ground around multiple blocks. It’s a peculiar place.
This is the base line.
All of this works together because there are basically no laws. A car goes through a red light, as long as it doesn’t hit someone it’s ignored. Same for u-turns, same for illegal temporary parking. You want to gun your car, make the wheels squeal and accelerate as fast as you can until the next red light? Nobody will care if you don’t hit someone.
It’s a zoo. The normal thinking of laws doesn’t really apply. If you get upset about every car that runs a red light, you’ll be upset all the time. If you get upset at people doing stupid shit, you’ll be upset all the time.
Ah, it’s okay if you ignore the laws because everyone else is doing it too.
In that case it sounds like Darwinism on NYC streets and cyclists and motorists alike earn whatever comes their way.
LOL. Yeah, that pretty much sums it up.
Bikes going wrong way on a one way seems just straight up reasonable. In Chicago where I’m at they even have lanes on some one ways specifically for bikes to do that.
Have been in Manhattan the last couple of days, the bikes (and especially the fast ebikes) are a damn menace. The cars at least stop for crosswalks and signals. The bikes absolutely do not. Got stuck at that big bike crosswalk near Central Park West as hordes of bikes just blew the red light, meant specifically for them in their dedicated bike lane.
Yes, they are currently unregulated and not street legal, so if you break the law, you face the consequences. Motor vehicles have their own statutes, but etransportation does not yet ha e anything, and I’ll bet automotive manufacturers will continue to fight to keep it that way so people continue to buy cars instead. What should be done about it? I haven’t a clue.
Mopeds have been a thing for a long time and electric has been an option for a long time. Also bike delivery has been a thing in NYC for a long time. That they are not street legal doesn’t make sense to me. Unless for the same reason a Mustang is street legal but a Mach E is not.
Electric vehicles like scooters and the like is what I meant. Mopeds and bikes should be following the rules of the road like any motor vehicle. I believe fully electric scooters are not street legal and can’t be insured. Bike couriers exist everywhere, and should be following the rules of the road too, but rarely do. Cars and their drivers are little better, but theres an entire arm of legislation that governs them where as none really exist for any other mode of travel?
Why cap the scooter at 15 mph? It seems like that would make it too slow to ride in the same traffic as cars.
I stand corrected. This is actually a really good infographic.
I occasionally visit new York, and this was long overdue I understand eco friendiness and it’s nice that it’s not cars but, it’s insane there.
for those who have never been. The sidewalks and roads are absolutely littered with food delivery drivers. There are walking areas that as a pedestrian you can’t walk because you risk getting run over by delivery drivers on bikes who only care about delivering as fast as possible to maximize their money. In a city with as heavy pedestrian traffic as NY that’s a bad combination.
I fully agree with mandated court hearings for traffic violations on them, it forces the delivery driver to lose a day’s income instead of just accounting it as a cost of the job. the previous penalties wern’t doing jack.
It sucks that non-commercial might get hit, but most bike traffic is commercial and something has to give.
This is the subheading on the article (emphasis added):
Some worry that New York City’s crackdown on unsafe cyclists leaves them facing greater consequences than drivers, even though cars cause more fatalities.
So why let drivers off the hook? You seem to care about safety, but then support enforcement that disproportionately affects those who are doing less harm? There’s no logic, it’s just vibes.
Culturally, we accept drivers causing a significant amount of death and destruction, but get so mad about anyone else. It’s not rational.
I’m not saying let the drivers off the hook, I’m just saying that bikers, from what I’ve seen there usually get ignored or just continue after fines, it’s clear the punishment wasn’t high enough. Hell I was just there in March and saw 3 people get hit and a bunch bikers just ignore the lights. (and ofc a crap ton of pedestrians as well but yea)
I’ve lived here for almost two decades and I’ve almost never had a problem with bikes.
I did once see a driver make a right turn and hit a delivery bike kid, drag him for a few feet, and then speed off. Luckily, teenagers I guess are indestructible and the kid got up and rode away after a few minutes.
If you want better bike and pedestrian safety, the solution is probably build better bike lanes. There are a lot of spots with nothing, or a painted suggestion. There’s a spot near prospect park where they expect the bicyclist to turn right, pass through a lane of traffic, and then just hang out in the center lane with all the cars. It’s a nightmare.
There was a video a long while ago where a cyclist got a ticket for not riding in the bike lane.
So he filmed himself riding in the bike lanes and crashing into the parked cars there and one of them was a cop.
It’s clear that politicians don’t give a fuck about cyclists.
The cops always park in the bike and pedestrian lanes in prospect park, and it makes me so mad.
Personally I feel like if you park in the bike lane for any reason that’s not life or death, people should be allowed to do what they want to your car. Maybe move it. Maybe key it. I don’t care. It’s a hazard for everyone.
Like when firefighters run their hoses through the busted out windows of cars blocking hydrants
While I wouldn’t go as far as keying, I fully agree if you park in a protected lane such as a fire lane, bike lane, handicap etc any damages accumated in the lane should be the drivers responsibility.
I fully agree, more biking accessible options becoming available wouod be good. it’s not safe from either side.
I occasionally visit New York
Ngl I stopped reading there. But I had to go back just to make sure your opinion didn’t matter
I’m glad when someone confirms they read the post ahead of time. Makes commenting easier. It’s a tad ironic you are doing the same as you are complaining about though
<-- A tourist.
then give that shit to those driving the motorized vehicles that weigh a few tons
Cars don’t drive on sidewalks. Well… at least not usually. Though I guess I have to admit that I’ve seen it.
I mean no reason both couldn’t be done I agree
That’s the to to lamest excuse I’ve heard for such an egregious double standard.
I’m curious what’s the double standard here?
Well, I can easily identify two. The standards applied to cyclists versus motorists, as well as the fact that commercial vehicles vs civilian makes no difference. At least from your description.
Separate from that is the general problem that couriers are essentially coerced into behaving so irresponsibly by corporate greed, but that’s a whole other can of worms of course.
ah that makes sense thank you, I’ll clarify it some. I didn’t specifically say so but, I don’t personally agree that it should be biker vs car enforcement based, I’m just glad they are doing /something/ about the bikers whom seem to had been just ignored previously.
As for commercial vs personal, I do think it would be better to impose stricter penalty for commercial though, as like you said there is higher incentive to cut corners/break laws, which means the same penalty doesn’t weigh as much when it’s getting you more money or making you look better for a larger company.
Thank you for the additional clarification. And naturally, potentially mitigating solutions such as bike lanes are so often demonized in our society, not because it actually causes disruptions to traffic, though; I figure it really is all about drivers getting jealous because they see people on bicycles not getting stuck in traffic (in my not so humble opinion). Not to mention how many violations of basic road safety and laws get handwaved because “they need their car”.
But I do agree that endangering pedestrians is no solution. I guess it infuriates me that real solutions are ignored/refused for such ridiculous reasons.
