Mandatory arbitration agreement for a protein shake or whatever it is. First it may not be enforceable. Second it makes me think that this product is not fit for consumption.
Write on the money you used to purchase this by accepting this money you agree to the terms of service…
Eat shit turdblossoms.
No way this is legally binding. It amounts to a bait and switch. A product was purchased and provided without agreement to any further terms. Then they sneak in supposed terms after the fact based upon the action of opening the product. That is a change in agreement made without any consideration for the purchaser. That’s not generally allowed in contact law.
Furthermore, I really doubt that they can get away with the argument that the act of opening a product can constitute any amount of conscious agreement to some writing on a package. If for no other reason than that this is (afaik) a novel way to attempt to coerce agreement such that nobody would expect such an agreement to be part of the opening process and likely won’t notice it.
And it’s not accessible for every person who may be using this product even if they do notice the words. Are you a non-English speaker? Farsighted? Blind? Illiterate? Would you have any way to even be aware that those words are terms that somehow binding you to an agreement by virtue of your opening the thing you just bought? Would you have any reason to even suspect that that is the case?
Also, they’ll undoubtedly claim that the fact that you have the opened product means that you agreed to the terms, but that is also not the case. Your mom opened it for you and wrapped it as a gift? You bought it secondhand? The packaging was torn open when it shipped to you and you never had any reason to see this text in the first place? It was misprinted? Any of those things and more would mean you never agreed to anything. And they have no way to prove any of those things weren’t the case.
Just stupid. I have zero doubt that any number of lawyers would love take this to court and get that payday.
All it does is prove to the purchaser that the fuckers don’t trust the basic safety and fitness for use of their product. Spectacular self own.
Absofuckinglutely
If I bought it and got home and found this, I’d return it as I have before. You’re not trapping me into agreeing for anything without the notice on the OUTSIDE of the product packaging. Fuck this
Plus it speaks volumes to the product itself. If they’re trying to pull shit like this there’s no way I’m trusting whatever they’re trying to get me to put in my body.
Yeah, feels like a trick.
Is there a bigger red flag than a message on it saying ‘if you break this seal you can’t sue us!’
Ackchyually, that makes it easier to sue them.
Attorney: -calls witness, a physicist- Physicist: “by simply observing this product, even without opening it, your clients life was changed in some way.” Attorney: “crazy label people, pay up!”
There’s an easy solution: keep buying it, break the seal to get to the message, then return it. Have your friends do the same, at the same store. Pretty soon that product will be gone and you can move on to the next store.
If the store starts to bitch about it, you can claim that you wanted to see if the statement had been removed.
This isn’t mildly annoying, this is corporate hellscape.
Forced Arbitration should be illegal everywhere.
Open it from the bottom.
I hope you returned that shit. That’s not mildly infuriating, that’s capitalism has officially run amok and needs to be taken out back and shot in the head
Add to this the fact they try to enforce mandatory arbitration - a thing that shouldn’t ever exist to begin with, in any jurisdiction, and is actually unenforceable in many.
In most of Europe, no contract can take away legal rights
Same in the USA, but that doesn’t mean they won’t try.
I’m pretty sure forced arbitration is in fact legal and enforceable in the US (at least for the most part? I am not a lawyer)
Unfortunately, the US doesn’t yet consider that a legal right. Sadly, courts take the position that if you don’t agree with the terms, don’t buy the product. Even in the cases where you couldn’t access the terms ahead of the sale.
Exactly
It doesn’t matter if you can’t afford the lawsuit.
The legal system in Australia is better because if you win a lawsuit, the losing side usually has to pay your legal fees. As a result, there’s far fewer frivolous lawsuits, and companies don’t drag out lawsuits hoping the other party runs out of money (which is a common tactic in the USA), since they could be on the hook for all those costs.
Then lack or presence thereof won’t help you, either.
It says you’re bound by “opening and using” the product, rather than “opening or using”. Have someone else open it for you. Then neither of you have done both.
Thus is the kind of legalistic bullshit interpretation I can get right behind
Contractual malicious compliance let’s go
Yeah but just to be clear, the terms are likely there for a reason and using this product probably has risks associated.
The only product I want to use with a liability waiver attached is the bungie cord at the fair.
Apparently, it’s full of lead.
Why would a bungee cord have lead?
Weight makes you go faster
I think it should be “and/or” because if it’s just “or” the terms would only apply if you either open it or use it.
No, that’s xor
I think having someone open if for you still counts. You’d have to already find one opened.
Leave it in a workplace fridge with a clear sticker saying “MIKES DO NOT TOUCH”
This is Vital Proteins brilliant response to being taken to court over heavy metal and “foreign materials” contamination in their products.
Do you have any supporting links? I saw a reddit post saying something similar but I cant find a real article or support. Either way I am returning the product.
https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/prop65/complaints/2017-02480C5316.pdf
Found searching ‘“vital proteins” lawsuit’
Sued by an environmental nonprofit for failing to warn about the presence of lead and heavy metals as required by CA law. They settled.
Seems like a labelling issue due to california laws rather than legitimate ingredient flaws with toxic or heavy metals.
Honestly you should assume all supplements are toxic and full of heavy metals, because that shit is virtually unregulated.
To some degree I totally agree. If you don’t find 3rd party lab verified then I’d be skeptical. Not just any 3rd party. It has to be from legitimate Orgs and trusted vendors.
I’m unsure how much people look at labels now days, unless you have a health issue requiring it. The levels of say vitamins manufacturers add to even like biotin or other vitamins/supplements. Thousands and sometimes 10s of thousands more than a daily dose your body can consume. Which means your kidneys or liver have to process that out. Things are toxic in high doses.
Its all about balance. A lot of these supplements are way way out of balance. It’s a shame, businesses or people can’t be reputable.
Found searching ‘“vital proteins” lawsuit’
that’s just cheating
perhaps related to this?
https://www.health.com/vital-proteins-collagen-peptides-recall-2023-7510523
Holy shit. How does this not just reduce their sales to 0?
Well, the purchase is probably already made by the time this is seen, and for those who see it, they probably just ignore it similarly to EULA popups when installing programs.
It’s not legally binding.
Assuming you’re talking about the US, this is correct.
In the US you need to both actively acknowledge acceptance of the T&Cs, which simply opening a package typically doesn’t meet.
Also, and arguably more important, they need to include the entirety of the T&Cs for you to be able to review before accepting. This means on the packaging or presented at time of purchase, not requiring you to go elsewhere to find them or having to search them out.
Now even though it’s not legally enforceable, I’d say it’s still scummy and companies that do it should be avoided.
The same way millions of
fucking moronsregular non-political people voted for drumpf: they thought, “well all politicians are bad, so it’s not like voting for a bad guy is bad.”Most companies have loads of legalese attempting to protect themselves. Contrary to popular belief, that does not make them all equal.
Those things aren’t even remotely similar to each other in terms of badness.
An analogy doesn’t have to be identical to never the less share similarities. I even spelled out the part to consider: Just because two things are bad does not make them equally bad.
You know how all these companies are making it lives shittier?
Well people are what companies are. And people are the absolute fucking worst.
And unfortunately there are on orders of magnitude more shitty people who don’t run the worst companies in existence than there are people who work for the worst of companies that are making them what they are.
Find your people, the ones that don’t suck, because there are a lot more people who only want what’s convenient for them and can’t spare one spark of concern for all of the consequences that affect entirely too many people that don’t want their decisions
Are you saying poop can be religious? It’s an inanimate object so I disagree. Your whole comment is dumb.
See I ignored the rest and just assumed. That’s how.
Just wait until you hear about holy water.
I do get the point of your comment, but I couldn’t resist
Edit: it’s also funny as hell that you got downvoted, thereby proving your point. People really don’t read to the end of things
A good attorney could argue that drilling a hole in the side of the carton does not constitute opening the package.
The cap also says “by using”, so you have been outlawyered. You’ve been had. You have forfeited all your rights. You are now a property of Big Protein. Better luck next time.
By opening AND using.
A good lawyer would surely argue that they didn’t open and use it.
Can claim negligence if that label is entirely removed prior to use, just say that it wasn’t there when you used it.
Would love to see them try and enforce whatever EULA they wrote up.
They’ll drag out any legal challenge in hopes you won’t want to pay for months of legal fees fighting it, on top of whatever legal fees are incurred that caused you to challenge it in the first place…
Sometimes mandatory arbitration doesn’t work out so well for companies either as Valve found out. When they run into what are effectively class action lawsuits but they get forced into individual arbitration with hundreds of thousands of people that clause starts to look really dumb.
And fuck the American Arbitration Association.
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