You know guys, the issue here really is that while you can imagine a tone while reading, unless there’s actually an objective indicator as to what it’s supposed to be, there’s going to be mismatches.
I don’t think we give enough credence to the magic of language. We’re looking at essentially a binary table of black and white, the white forming letters, those letters then forming words and those words eliciting specific thoughts. The fact that the tone isn’t conveyed properly is a very minor thing. But we can’t really imagine completely toneless speech, so sometimes neutral seems aggressive and sometimes sarcastic seems obtuse.
Which I grant I honestly took your comment as well for the first 3 seconds. You never know online. You just. Can’t know. No matter how seemingly obvious it seems to be from context. Poe’s law and all that
Well said, however there are universally accepted indicators within litterature that are used to convey such tone. Not to mention they completely lacked any connotative words that would have helped the average person decipher that instantly. My original message “youre being cheeky right?” was litterally questioning “what side are you on?” because without tone or connotation they might actually hold these beliefs. I think we can agree that they could have easily wrote the original message using these litterary devices to convey the message and connotation perfectly
“It used to be pulp literature, cinema, comics, television, Rock’n’Roll and VHS that spoiled our young. Now it’s definitely video games.”
Heck, I sure was as ambiguous as the whole discussion is and always was. Claims of cinema, even theater (even drama in ancient Greece), VHS etc, were a danger to to the general public and specifically to the youth were absolutely real. They even had some point. It’s just the fact that the same blame game has been played again and again with every new medium that emerged that has some intrinsic irony. Obviously communication channels can be used by miscreants to spread ugly stuff. Who might have thought? And still people are acting as if thit was new or unexpected. I didn’t even have to point thar out, just the sheer mentioning of these undoubted historic facts did the job. Make your own conclusions from that, everyone, but don’t be surprised or upset when the next big thing will be used to spoil the youth just again. Because it will happen. It never stopped happening.
I think history kinda shows us they did not in fact have any sort of a point besides being irate about new technology.
The point is text doesn’t convey tone, or even necessarily have any, but texts is read as speech, and speech has a tone. A lot of the times our internal translators just pick the wrong one.
You know guys, the issue here really is that while you can imagine a tone while reading, unless there’s actually an objective indicator as to what it’s supposed to be, there’s going to be mismatches.
I don’t think we give enough credence to the magic of language. We’re looking at essentially a binary table of black and white, the white forming letters, those letters then forming words and those words eliciting specific thoughts. The fact that the tone isn’t conveyed properly is a very minor thing. But we can’t really imagine completely toneless speech, so sometimes neutral seems aggressive and sometimes sarcastic seems obtuse.
Which I grant I honestly took your comment as well for the first 3 seconds. You never know online. You just. Can’t know. No matter how seemingly obvious it seems to be from context. Poe’s law and all that
Well said, however there are universally accepted indicators within litterature that are used to convey such tone. Not to mention they completely lacked any connotative words that would have helped the average person decipher that instantly. My original message “youre being cheeky right?” was litterally questioning “what side are you on?” because without tone or connotation they might actually hold these beliefs. I think we can agree that they could have easily wrote the original message using these litterary devices to convey the message and connotation perfectly
“It used to be pulp literature, cinema, comics, television, Rock’n’Roll and VHS that spoiled our young. Now it’s definitely video games.”
Heck, I sure was as ambiguous as the whole discussion is and always was. Claims of cinema, even theater (even drama in ancient Greece), VHS etc, were a danger to to the general public and specifically to the youth were absolutely real. They even had some point. It’s just the fact that the same blame game has been played again and again with every new medium that emerged that has some intrinsic irony. Obviously communication channels can be used by miscreants to spread ugly stuff. Who might have thought? And still people are acting as if thit was new or unexpected. I didn’t even have to point thar out, just the sheer mentioning of these undoubted historic facts did the job. Make your own conclusions from that, everyone, but don’t be surprised or upset when the next big thing will be used to spoil the youth just again. Because it will happen. It never stopped happening.
I think history kinda shows us they did not in fact have any sort of a point besides being irate about new technology.
The point is text doesn’t convey tone, or even necessarily have any, but texts is read as speech, and speech has a tone. A lot of the times our internal translators just pick the wrong one.